I don’t like that I won’t see you in Heaven

In my view, one of the hardest discussions a couple can have, when one of them has deconverted, is one that involves hell and the afterlife.

The simple fact is; the partner that remains a Christian must at some point consider their views on hell and how that affects their deconverted spouse. It matters not if they subscribe to annihilation or eternal damnation or any other form of hell, the bottom line is that they must come to terms with the idea that their earthly partner will no longer spend eternity with them in heaven. Christian theology has a high focus on the afterlife, which means that this could be a particularly painful or distressing process.

My creationist view of hell was always one of eternal damnation. I never saw it as cruel or vengeful; to me it was simply the just deserts of the faithless as their punishment for sin. If, having known the consequences, they still chose to not follow Jesus, then who was I to feel sorry them? So I didn’t.

The fate of my deconverted brothers did concern me. I also had a moment after my grandfather died when I needed to know that I’d see him in heaven. Not knowing the destination of his soul caused me some distress for a while. I eventually came to terms with not knowing but it wasn’t a situation I particularly relished. This is the damage that such extremist views cause.

It’s with this knowledge that I am relieved that my wife never shared the same view of hell that I did. She takes a much more liberal interpretation, saying that hell is simply separation from God, IE not being in heaven. She doesn’t see it as the physical place of punishment that I did.

Even with this much milder post death placement, she still found time one night to say she didn’t like idea that I’d not be in heaven with her. For a brief moment I thought I glimpsed genuine distress at the thought but she wouldn’t be pressed on it and instead preferred not to talk about the subject. I don’t know how much Mrs limey had thought about it up to that point or even if it’s entered her thoughts since. I suspect the latter is not much because when she says something is not a subject she wants to consider anymore, she tends to mean exactly that.

As a result, we’ve not discussed the subject since and I don’t intend to push her on it. For our specific situation, the path we’ve agreed is to leave that one alone. I suspect that this will be the same for many other couples in our situation. There is no benefit in having the conversation because there isn’t a common ground for us to move towards, it’s not like it’s a discussion on where we should take out next holiday.

I do wonder if this is precisely the kind of situation that has led to Universalism, the belief that everyone eventually ends up in heaven anyway. This seems a particularly insulting cop out and makes no sense to me at all. I genuinely struggle with how this can even be justified theologically, which is why I wonder if Universalism came about because some people simply can’t deal with the idea that there are those they love who will go to hell. It’s also a great example of how religious belief is twisted by individuals to suit their own perspectives and must surely be seen as evidence that religion is manmade not god made.

I’ll ignore completely the issue of how heaven deals with multiple partners. Both of my parents remarried Christians and I’m not particularly keen on either of their second spouses (an understatement) so that’s an angelic orgy I’m not even interested in being around for. If ever there was a reason for avoiding heaven, I’ve got the jackpot covered!

I appreciate Mrs limey’s honesty in saying it’s not a subject she wants to revisit. It’s also hard to see where there would be benefit in the discussion. I’d deny the existence of both heaven and hell and she’d express disappointment that I won’t join her in heaven and I’d say, well of course I’m not going to heaven and I don’t really care because dead is dead and I’ll not be any the wiser. Deep or meaningful theological discussion isn’t really going to happen there. This isn’t a subject where a meaty and healthy discussion can happen. Subjects like the evidence that other apes have a concept of fair play or right and wrong have much more going for them in that respect.

Personally, I think Mrs limey is right in that it’s a subject best left alone. It works for us because, as I’ve lain out above, it’s not going to make for a long discussion and there is no possible end point where we would feel we’ve had a fruitful conversation. Other couples in this situation may choose to find their own ways of dealing with it, but I don’t think there are many options that don’t end with one partner feeling depressed at the thought of eternal loss.

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2 thoughts on “I don’t like that I won’t see you in Heaven

  1. In that situation it might do not to view it as a discussion to be had but as an opportunity to reassure her that you don’t simply reject heaven because you don’t want to be with her for eternity, or that the idea that your time with her ends with the last beat of your heart pains you but that you simply can’t believe something because you’d like it to be so. What she is saying is that she loves you and that her beleifs force her to imagine eternity without you and it saddens her, since she’s closed to discussing the point, it sounds like she doesn’t want to argue, but rather that she wants to hear that you love her too.

    Depending on the mood then, you might be able to nudge her a bit more to the liberal side by then injecting a quip about how you’d think a God with any character wouldn’t merely invite to the after-party the ones who liked his book.

  2. Pingback: Hell Conversation | Confessions Of A YEC

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